Re: [HoE] Junkman Cometh and Mad Science

["Fuzyn9feet" <Fuzyn9feet@email.msn.com>]

>   I recently got the aforementioned book, and just thought I would share
>some of my comments cosmology wise.  Cosmologically, not only did the book
>mess up the hucksters (but we have already had this conversation, so let's
>not go there), but the mad scientists as well.
>   Okay, everyone knows that mad scientists are people who get inspired by
>the manitou.  No problem so far.  In the main Hell on Earth rulesbook, the
>manitou were showing them future technology, and stopped showing them when
>all the preparation for doomsday came. Admittedly, a slight problem there.

It also says in the same section that the manitous showed the scientists
arcane rituals.

>If the manitous were showing the mad scientists future tech, then how come
>there doesn't seem to be a limit to what a mad scientist could create?
Mind
>control helmets, freeze guns, time machines, the mad scientists could
create
>technology that every indication says didn't exist (or at least wasn't
known)
>before the bombs fell, although admittedly it is possible the manitou
weren't
>limited to the hell on earth time when it came to reverse engineering.

I like to think of the "future tech" as more of the "idea of the future."
After all normal tech never came up with mind control helmets, freeze guns &
time machines. It sounds more like Buck Rogers and our collective image of
the future and it's technologies.

>   And then there is the great Junkman Cometh retconn.  In which there is a
>division between mad and "normal" science, and no mad scientist understood
>anything about the least mad science invention once the manitou stopped
>playing.  Previously, it looked like the only reason mad science technology
>was so prone to unreliability was that mad scientists truly didn't
understand
>the technology, never mind that I find that slightly insulting to humanity.

Again we also have to look back to the arcane rituals aspect.

>If the likes of Newton, Einstein, Tesla, or Edison were inspired by
manitou,
>they wouldn't have any chance of truly understanding the technology they
were
>working with?  Somehow I don't think so. But now Pinnacle seems to be
saying
>that no mad scientist, no matter how intelligent or knowledgeable, couldn't
>invent a paper clip without a manitou whispering in their head, or at least
>that is what the division between mad and pure science says to me.

In JMC it talks about some Mad Scientists moving on to work in regular areas
(that is if they copped with the loss of their muses). Other learned how to
manipulate the manitous directly and kept working.

>Furthermore, junkman cometh pretty blatantly implied that nobody could
>understand even previously invented mad tech when the manitou stopped
playing
>muse.  And that I don't understand at all.  Hellstrome couldn't even
remember
>how to put together a flame thrower because his muse went away?  Doesn't
that
>seem wrong somehow to anybody else?  The manitou gave the mad scientists
the
>knowledge, which the mad scientist gets to play with afterward.  I don't
see
>why the manitou would be in the least bit important after giving the mad
>scientist the knowledge, or vision, or dream, or however it works.

It also hinted at (if not saying) that not all that the manitous stop
talking to everyone. There were some that worked on the City Busters and
refinded them.

>   I admit, it is possible that I just don't understand the cosmology and
>theory of how mad science works, in which case could someone explain it to
>me?

It's one of those things that we are all going to see different things in
the same passage (not to mention the endless insights and speculations like
the Buck Rogers one I have).

Christopher Merrill
W.H.A.T.T. Member