[BNW] Re: Goliath balancing (was Strength Bonus)

["Steve Crow" <crow_steve@hotmail.com>]

>From: "Patrick Legg" <plegg@lineone.net>
>
> >
> > Honestly, it really depends on the feel you want for your campaign, and
>what
> > the players want the feel to be. Short of you describing everything in
> > tiresome detail (for us and for you, typing-wise :) ), I don't think we
>can
> > answer every problem they might be having.
> >
> > I guess the one question I would ask is:  does the players'
>dissatisfaction
> > basically stem from the fact that they have a Goliath in their group, 
>and
> > the rest of the PCs can't keep up?  That seems to be the case from what
>you
> > described, but I would hate to presume.
>
>It stems more from certain players inability to roleplay the situations. 
>The
>goliath probably won't be the guy who starts the fights, but he'll end up
>being as involved as the rest of them. difference being, he won't get hurt.
>
>to be fair the situation can aabout from a gadgetter (minus gadget) trying
>to get information out of a guy that didn't have any, as he was an extra.
>the gadgetter then starts a fight, i'm stuck with either everyone in a
>rough, tough bar (including key characters) running away and the hero's
>loosing the only clues, or they fight this (very p***ed off) guy and his
>(very p***ed off) friends, and we run on from there. maybe i made the wrong
>decision.
>

There is no "wrong decision" grasshopper. :) Your basic decision was sound, 
IMO - to have a fight. The element where it seems to have fallen apart was 
simply that you underestimated the NPC opposition. Which is hardly a 
difficult thing to do, particularly if you had PCs as variable as the 
Goliath at one end of the scale and the least powerful PC (typically someone 
like a Healer, a Hacker, a Sneak, or perhaps the ungadgeted Gadgeteer) at 
the other.

In very broad strokes, what I would have done is slightly different stemming 
from your basic decision: I would have had the fight go down if the PCs 
pursued the matter, but not have DP show up right away. Let the PCs what 
they found out, get clear of the bar, and then have Delta Prime on their 
trail as an element they kinda/sorta added to the adventure themselves.  
That gives you a few more options to play around with, as they dodge other 
DP/investigative types, before the big gun Armageddon Pilots get called in.

But bringing the Armageddons in right away as you did is okay, too. Depends 
on what your feel is for how quick they respond in your campaign.

Again, I don't think you made a mistake here, except in perhaps 
underestimating how powerful the DPs are. BNW doesn't lend itself too well 
to combat balancing: a combination of open-ended die-rolling, some variation 
with Tricks, and the wide range of Power Packages makes that difficult.  
It's the kind of thing that comes with experience, and sometimes not even 
then.  ;)
>
>
> >
> > If it is, then disallow the Goliath and as Theo says, let them have a
> > Scrapper instead.
>
>well, that'd mean they were all less likely to survive it. probably a 
>better
>idea, because we could then reset the adventure and they could all have
>another go.
>

Well, then you tone down the level of threat. Like I noted earlier, you put 
a Goliath in a group and you're raising the stakes. Goliaths do one thing 
real well; combat. They can be the best detective in the world as well, but 
that Obvious thing is just going to hurt them if they try to covertly 
interrogate witnesses, investigate crime scenes, etc.

This seems to then lead to the fact that a Goliath is going to be bored out 
of combat, but a predominant factor in combat. The Goliath player may find 
this frustrating, if nothing else.

There are enough other combat types out there who can be a bit mroe subtle 
(Blaster, Scrapper, Tough to some degree, the were-shapeshifters from Glory 
Days and Evil Unlimited).  If the player(s) in question absolutely have to 
have a combat monster, I'd direct them to those.

Again, without knowing the general makeup of your party, my suggestion would 
be: throw as many people as it takes to make the fight interesting for 
everyone. In a bar fight, throw 10 patrons at the Goliath, and 1 patron at 
each of the others (unless they're advanced-combat type Blasters, Scrappers, 
etc., too).

If the Armageddons come calling, throw 2-3-4 at the Goliath and throw one at 
each 1-2 other PCs.  This makes sense from the Armageddon's point of view: 
they know how dangerous a Goliath is!

The exact numbers that will make the fight "balanced" are something you'll 
have to work out based on how skilled your PCs are, and what Power Packages 
there are. Still, the Goliath can be problematical, and I'd advise caution 
with anyone considering lettting one be included as a PC. There are only one 
or two Power Packages that could cause problems: Bargainer and Covenant, and 
that's more because of the moral limitations they suffer on 
using/increasing/maintaining their powers.

Add a Goliath to the PC mix, and you've either got a campaign that's going 
to be less "subtle" and more combat, or a player that may be very bored 1/2 
to 1/3rd of the time.

Hope that helps.



---

Steve Crow

"Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority."

Check out my website at:  http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/4991/


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