Re: [[BNW] Brave New World site]

[David Fryer <badsign_98@yahoo.com>]

--- Phillip Bernstein <GSZalonef@netscape.net> wrote:
> David Fryer <badsign_98@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >I have been working on a website which would
> develop
> >the Brave New World game for Marvel Super-Heroes.
> 
> I have kept out of this discussion as it came up in
> the past, but since this
> idea keeps coming up, I am gonna toss my hat into
> the ring.
> 
Always glad to hear from an opposing viewpoint Phil.

> I normally love the idea of swapping settings from
> game to game (these days I
> am spending ALOT of time messing with Big Eyes Small
> Mouth), but this one
> disturbs me.  It has been pointed out before -- BMW
> is not a four color comic
> book.

Agreed. This would be a Frank Miller book through and
through.

  MSH is SPECIFICALLY designed to play a 4
> color comic book setting, so
> there are some real incompatabilities in the
> mechanics.

I have to disagree here. The Marvel system doesn't
specificly cover four color comics. Look at things
like Midnight Sons, Marvel Knights, and other grim
books for examples. However since Marvel is mainly a
four color company that is what the system is mostly
set up for.

  The largest one, in
> my opinion, is the fundamental limiting of power
> improvement in BNW.  MSH has
> a good mechanic for increasing powers, and
> experienced Marvel players will be
> unhappy with this mechanics removal from the system.

Actually if you were to talk to my players you would
find that it is very difficult to advance in my games.
For example to go from Ex(20) to Ex(21) in the Marvel
system requires 2100 karma points. This is very
difficult to save up when I only give each player
10-15 karma points per adventure. Plus I present them
with situations designed specificly to cause them to
spend karme, thus limiting how quickly they can
advance. If there is one thing to be said of me as a
Guide  it is that I hate high powered games.

>  Additionally, many of
> the power levels that have been proposed for this
> system conversion are a
> little on the high side. 

I agree that some are on the high side. However I have
tried to keep the powers low key and only set a high
base if there is material to support it, such as being
able to determine an exact speed which a Flyer flies
or a Speedster runs.  Otherwise I try and keep it
right around Ex or Rm which would be average.

 This issue needs some
> additional research, but
> examining the power of Omega Flight and/or the Great
> Lake Avengers (there have
> been several posts about using these 2 groups in
> BNW) can provide some base
> levels for this project.
> 
> My biggest concern is the potential loss of feel
> caused by switching the
> setting between the two systems.  This is a subtle
> issue, and it is difficult
> to explain.

I understand exactly what you mean. 

  It is the difference between Call of
> Cthulhu and Chill.  CoC is a
> game about horror, and horror is a genre of VICTIMS.
>  The fundamental truth of
> CoC  is that the investigators cannot make a true
> difference in the game
> setting.  They may delay the various entities plans
> (and gain the remainder of
> their life free of the entities' influence), but in
> the end, all of humanity
> is truly insignificant on the cosmic scale.  Chill,
> on the other hand, looks
> like a horror game, but it is a hero game.  The
> players are given abilities
> that place them on par with their avdersaries.  I
> have seen several attempts
> to convert the CoC universe over to the Chill Rules,
> and the bottom line is
> that the FEEL of the game didn't transfer.  This
> resulted in the quick demise
> of these campaigns.  I fear that the same will
> happen with the BNW setting
> with the MSH rules.

While this might be true about games like CoC and
Chill, Marvel and BNW are at their heart both Hero
games. BNW is a little grimmer the MSH but they both
focus on what is and what makes a hero. In BNW the
question is does breaking the law because it's the
right thing to do make you more or less of a hero then
then one who upholds the law above right and wrong.
Ultimately in a case like this it is upto the Guide to
mantain the differenc in feeling and a good Guide and
a good group should have no problems keeping the game
going.

> 
> I am not saying that such a conversion would not be
> interesting, and even fun.
>  But much of what makes BNW so good is the unique
> feel it has.  Anything that
> might lessen this feel will also lessen the impact
> and power of BNW.
> 
> Zalonef
> 
> 

Good points. However the concept behind the game, the
struggle which is at the heart of BNW is what creates
that feeling, in my opinion, not the mechanics of the
game. Therefore as long as you keep the basic concept
in mind then the system that you use should not
matter.

Another thing that should be kept in mind as well is
that this is a good way to get new players into BNW.
Instead of throwing all kinds of new material at them
you can ease them into by using a system they know to
teach them the basic ideas and then move them slowly
into the mechanics of the game. Much like you would
use say GURPS: Vampire to ease someone who has been a
long time GURPS player into a full on White Wolf WoD campaign.

=====
David Fryer
Bringing a little insanity to an insane world

"Television enables you to be entertained in your home by
people you wouldn't have in your home."

David Frost

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