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Re: [BNW] What is wrong with BNW?
>Steve Crow wrote:
> > <massive clipping of stuff I could care less about>
> > There is no secret about how someone becomes a Delta in BNW, so the
>analogy
> > doesn't work here. It's stated several times that the government
>maintains
> > a watch on emergency wards, disasters, etc.
>
>Okay this is going to raise big newbie flags across the list, and was
>one of the things at annoyed me about the system The Origin line on the
>character sheet is sitting right there but no where does it explicitly
>say how deltas get their powers. There is a two page discussion (that
>doesn't really say anything) about why deltas have their powers, as well
>as a few examples of deltas who had near death experiences, but do
>deltas also get their powers from radioactive spiders? I don't know.
>
It's certainly true, Matt wasn't as specific on that as he should have been
(he doesn't even bother to explain the "Origins" line on the character
sheet). :( However, reading all three books for content (an irritating
requirement, to be sure - no argument there!), that does seem to be the way
you become a Delta.
If the radioactive spider bite almost kills you (and I seem to recall Peter
Parker having high fever and stuff anyway...), then yes, it could result in
you becoming a Delta.
However (and again, this is a flaw with the game and something Matt _should_
have been clearer on), what (if any) is the correlation between the type of
near-death experience and the Delta power you gain? What kind of near-death
experience makes you a Bargainer rather than a Charmer? A Gadgeteer rather
than a Phaser? Or is it all random...?
><clipping the night away>
> > What I guess I'm not seeing here from your arguments is..._why_ do you
>need
> > to know _where_ Deltas get their powers from to run adventures?
>
>I don't want to know why. I want to know how.
>
By having a near-death experience, based on an overall reading of the rules.
To continue the analogy with Vampire, Vampire never absolutely
specifically says there is only one way to become a vampire (and at least
one early adventure gave a totally different way of becoming a vampire!).
><lots and lots of clipping>
> > Your concern here, as far as I can tell, is what do you do if your
>players
> > ask how they can become an Alpha? Apparently simply telling them they
>can't
> > do it is insufficient - you want to be able to tell them _why_ they
>can't
> > become an Alpha (and correct me if I'm wrong here).
>
>But you can do it! I distinctly remember being told by the book to keep
>the sheets of dead characters for later use...
>
Exactly. "later use." Do your players want to know how their character can
become an Alpha _now_? Tell them they can't, as per the rules, the current
environment caused by the bomb in '76, etc. Do they want to know how they
can become an Alpha later, and why are you saving those character sheets?
Tell them they'll find out later. Why is this disruptive? What harms are
this specifically causing to your campaign?
> > This strikes me as a somewhat irrelevant issue, relevant to the genre.
>You
> > don't see Aquaman asking how to or otherwise striving to become a
> > Superman-level character, or Spiderman attempting to gain the powers of
>an
> > Asgardian deity.
>
>Ah, but I'm not playing in the DC or Marvel universes. I'm playing on
>the Brave New World where such things have happened in the past.
>
And something happened in the more immediate past to prevent them from
happening again. Why are your players willing to accept that due to
whatever (unstated) reasons, something happened from the 40's up through '76
(Alphas manifesting) that _might_ have let them become Alphas then, but
unwilling to accept some equally as-yet unstated reasons for why it can
_not_ happen for them from '76 to the present day?
And of course, over the 50+ year history of DC Comics, there are examples of
Batman coming into Superman-level powers on a temporary basis...
*****
Overall, I agree that the origins thing _could_ have been clearer. But
there seems to be enough there to explain it. And in the "so what" category
for today...if you allow that a Bargainer simply got his "powers" by being
trained as a Bargainer from an early age without any near-death
experience...ummm, "so what"? If you change the origin/"how to get Delta
powers" thing slightly from what Matt has (presumably) done...so what?
Again, I guess I'm not really seeing the specific harms here. When you say,
"Your dead character may become an Alpha later in some manner - give me his
character sheet and create a new one, and I'll get back to you", _what_ is
the player then saying or doing that is giving you and/or your campaign
problems? Do they want to become an Alpha now (even though the rules and
the campaign setting are both clear that they can't), and are unhappy that
can't happen?
Ditto on the origin thing. So if a player comes up with a really cool
origin for his Gadgeteer that has nothing to do with a near-death
experience, and it works for you, and it makes for a better campaign, then
what in your campaign, right now, are the harms caused by this?
Heck, if six months down the road, Matt says in some supplement or another
that almost all delta powers came from near-death origins, what is the harm
if this one character has a non-near-death origin?
(And just as a note, given that Matt has remained somewhat vague on this
matter for good or for ill, do folks really think he's going to start
writing himself into an absolute corner down the road, much less requiring
every campaign to follow him into that same corner...?)
*shrug* I see what folks think are the problems with the game. What I
haven't seen to date is WHY these so called problems are problems for you...
---
Steve Crow
"Worm Can Opener Extraordinare"
Check out my website at: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/4991/
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