RE: Virus Notification

[John Williams <williams@morinda.com>]

On Thu, 10 Oct 2002, Laurent Devigne wrote:

> Well.. Well.. Well..
> This is not a fact that Microsoft write application that server as platform
> of viruses, the fact is that Microsoft application are fully integrated and
> could be connected to each one by using COM, VBSCript, Visual Basic for
> Application, etc...

No, it's the fact that "Microsoft applications are not designed for
security" to quote a Microsoft executive.

> Now if you are regarding Linux and MAC, the
> compatibility with Hardware are reduced,

I won't speak for MAC hardware, but the only problems I have on Linux is
with so-called win-modems.  I borrowed a digital camera a few months ago,
and the software for it was ALREADY INSTALLED on Linux.

> the communication between
> application an only be done via old mechanism or custom mechanism... Techno
> like CORBA are only accessible to high developper... etc...

You haven't been paying attention for the last few years.  KDE and Gnome
have got great CORBA support.  I don't use KDE personally, but I did
notice that it was possible to use CORBA from the command line to
customize apps while they are running.  Oh, and MAC has been able to do
that for a lot longer than Windows, at least if their bragging about
metacard is to be believed.

And don't criticize the command line.  Unix has had a fully programmable
shell since the beginning, and Windows has only recently got something
with similar functionality in Visual Basic.  Those "old mechanisms" you
criticize work very well, and don't have the security problems that
Windows has.

> - They've introduced whole new classes
> - of viruses that weren't possible before. Those who have been on the
> - internet more than 4 years ago might remember that, until Outlook came
> - along, the concept of an email virus was a widely propagated hoax!
> - There was no such thing!
>
> Yes, but they also instroduced new features, concepts, possibilities, etc..
> Visual Basic for application and COM objects integrated with Outlook gives a
> great way to interract with the email client, with the contact list, etc...
> And because this is so easy (and now everyone is able to customize its
> application using VB or COM, this is very good).

You may not consider yourself a programmer, but you are obviously in the
computer elite if you know how to do that.  The majority of users still
prefer to have someone else press the "next" button when they are
installing software.

> But some people use it to
> create virus... Every new technologies are potentialy not immune to any
> virus. Microsoft Outlook is a the best email client available. It can do
> many things and integrate calendar, contact, task in a single application
> and database and all that are accessible only by a single COM interface.
> That's great...

Outlook is an OK email client.  I'll let the Eudora folks argue that with
you.  But it really sucks as a PIM, not the least because by releasing it
for free, Microsoft killed a thriving market of innovative and competitive
products, most of which were better than minimal PIM features offered by
Outlook.

> On Linux and Mac, because of the security the system is not open and only
> "veterant" developpers are able to customize applications. So it's easy to
> say that Microsoft application are open to virus but there are also 500%
> more accessible and customizable by prog than Linux/Mac application. (This
> is a generality so don't give me an example of 1 software easly accessible
> or customizable by prog)...

So you are objecting to security!?

*Any* developer can customize a Linux application because the source is
available.  Mac users, from what I hearsay, have just as much
customizability as windows, and with OS-X, they have a security model now
too.

At least you are not claiming that windows is easier to *USE* than the
alternatives.  Anything is easy when you are familiar with it.

> Also Microsoft Windows is used on 80% of all the PC in the world. So If I
> choose to write a virus I will certainly do it for Microsoft Windows not for
> Linux or MacOS. That's why there are a lot a virus exeisting Microsoft
> Windows and not for other systems. Linux and MacOS are also vulnerable but
> no one is interrested by writing virus for them...

The 80% is true, so I thank you for serving as a virus magnet and keeping
them away from us.

But there is also an undeniable higher security fence for viruses to
jump on Unix and Mac OS-X.  Viruses cannot overwrite executables, because
the user doesn't have write permissions on the executables.  The OS never
came preconfigured with the entire hard drive shared to the world.  Unix
scripting languages (tcl/tk, perl, python, etc) have "safe" modes for
executing untrusted code.  Developers actually perform security audits on
their applications (especially networking apps).

Anyway, let's just all agree to disagree, and get back to gaming.

If you want to argue it further with me, pick a game (any game: my limits
are set) and we can discuss it over the board.

~ sharkey