Re: [HoE] Response to Steve

["Steve Crow" <crow_steve@hotmail.com>]

>Let me begin off by appologizing. I wrote that response before your 
>response
>to Jeff posted, and at the time it sounded to me like you were one of those
>people who felt like roleplaying was "I kill the orc and look in his pocket
>for his money." I've changed that impression since reading your later 
>replies.
>

No apology is necessary - I never got that impression from your response.

Although I wouldn't say that my players aren't occasionally like that...  :) 
  Which kind of begs the issue:  if your players build their characters for 
combat (i.e., Super Soldier, lots of combat Miracles and Syker abilities, 
belongins like a Battlesuit or even a pretty decent gun), and they spend the 
points, they want combat.  And their characters are probably not going to be 
(in character, at least) very interested in puzzle/mystery solving.

*shrug* The players I typically have are like this.  That doesn't make them 
excellent role-players:  they are.  But they are role-players that enjoy 
combat, and also enjoy role-playing during combat.

>My players do tend to make rolls for their persuasion, bluffs, etc. but 
>only
>after they've been roleplaying what their characters' have been saying, and
>only if I can't decide what the NPC's reaction would be. You are right 
>about
>certain groups wanting combat in their game. I spoke with my players at the
>beginning, and we were able to come to an agreement as to how much combat
>there should be. Like I said, I prefer to use it as an adventure's climax, 
>so
>those fights tend to be pretty spectacular. I haven't gotten any complaints
>yet, so I guess my group must be liking it.
>

There's where we differ - I always figure I'm there to give the players what 
they want.  I'm kinda flexible that way.

>As for HoE being more about combat, I'm not certain I agree about that. I
>think that there's plenty of mystery given to Marshals and Players in the
>Wasted West book to keep things interesting, but I do agree that the base 
>book
>does seem rather combat oriented. I've had to do a little work, but I've 
>been
>able to make there be mysteries in HoE, some of which (I feel) are the 
>equal
>to Call of Cthulhu. But I also don't just use wierd supernatural things in 
>my
>mysteries. One of the recurring themes in my adventures is the fact that
>humans are a source of evil as well as the fearmongers and servitors, so my
>posse tends to run up across mortals much more often then fearmongers. 
>Since I
>keep them pretty much to a restricted location (one fairly full of 
>corruption)
>I need to keep the fearmongers to a minimum (lest it just become like a 
>comic
>book). And my posse is no where near being ready to face a servitor. I 
>don't
>know if I want to go that direction anyway.
>


I think the problem here may be our differing views on what constitutes a 
"mystery."

I think there is plenty of "mystery" in the HoE universe:  where are the 
Reckoners, what's up with Simon, what happened to the President's plane, 
etc.  But these are things that the Marshal and players are not encouraged 
to explore, as they are part of the "main" storyline that Pinnacle is laying 
out.  This is pretty much described in the Templar Sourcebook.

There is the "track down the bad guy" mystery.  Where is his headquarters, 
how do we find it?  This often tends to boil down to skill rolls (Tracking, 
Area Knowledge, whatever), which develop clues that lead directly to the 
"answer."

And finally there are the more...cerebral mysteries, of the "Who shot Joe 
the Caravan driver?"  Clues are often gathered via skill rolls, but the 
players must then decipher them.


>Of course, I do understand if your group doesn't want to go the route mine 
>is.
>The first group I played with (this was Deadlands) loved combat, and turned
>everything into dice rolls. It infuriated me enough that I left the group 
>(a
>few of the sessions were nothing more than one long combat). That's why I
>talked to my players about combat before I started.

Well, we've strayed a bit from my original point, that some folks I've dealt 
with, newbies, find the "default trait" system a bit frustrating because 
important role-playing stuff is left to a skill, while Traits can be used 
quite happily for Quickness  checks in combat, and Cognition checks in 
combat, and Vigor/Stun Recovery checks in combat.  Would that, say, Mien 
were as...friendly to assisting role-playing as Quickness assist combat.

But I certainly wouldn't mind seeing the combat simplified so you don't need 
to be making 3-6 rolls for each bullet/strike.  that strikes me as more 
important, and would be of greater assistance in making the game 
"newbie-friendly", then overhauling the movement system or the base 
unskilled-trait stuff.

---

Steve Crow

"Worm Can Opener Extraordinare"

Check out my website at:  http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/4991/


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