Re: [DL] The Experience Game was:What's a death spiral?

[Sam & Max <samnmax@swbell.net>]

> 
>  >If it's any consolation, I find the Challenge Ratings in D&D worse than
>  >useless.
> 
> If the CR's actually had a standard they used, but the difference between
> two CR 3 critters is juge.
> 
> I just divide the XP reward by two and eyeball each monster to adjust them
> down or up the couple of CR's they need to match the party.
> 

Okay..
	 I am launching into this because just did a bunch of fixing and working on the
3rd Ed. Exp because I too found the CR system to be a huge crock. Advancement
speeds aside, the sheer ambiguity of the CR was awful. The inability to make up
a creature that could be accurately presented was my biggest hang up. Now I KNOW
I could say .. "Well its a CR 3" so there. Or eyeball it. But the system from
second edition seemed to be a lot easier to use and be consistant. Finding the
HD and then adding abilities from there.  Now I know the CR systems are
preferred for the newbie friendly 3rd Ed. They work (sorta) with the Encounter
level set to give a good quick balance of monsters. 
	I first started dividing the EXP by 3 similar to Allans solution but found even
this was a bit off and still didn't do anything to let me construct monsters
quickly or accurately. A Dragon magazine article on Monster building was
written. And in affect said. "Here.. just use this Guesstimator." Hmm helpful.
:) 
	Well I am not sure how we did it but we have what I think is an accurate Exp
building Chart for 3rd ED.  It has a big list of stuff like Flies, Has Magic
Item Usable against party, Casts 3rd or Higher spells.. blah blah. If you are
familiar with 2nd Ed from the DM's side you will probably know what I am talking
about. Feats are not considered by the way due to players having them as well
plus :) they were not really quantifiable in this case. The easy part is ever HD
and ability equals roughly 120 EXP. Or if you like the slower advancement 80 or
40.  On a few creatures this was off a bit. But in 90% of the 3rd ED Monster
Manual.. they monsters were within 10% of the chart. 

	Well when it comes down to it.. You give me a HD number and a beasties
abilities and I can give you its EXP value. And what combination of Classes /
levels will be a rough challenge for it. And no, the idea I use does NOT assume
every party out there has four members. :)  
	Anyway..  If anyone is interested I will E-mail a copy of the list of abilities
and points.  It does take character levels into account. be them over or under a
beasties effective power by a substantial amount but I have bored everyone here
long enough. :) 
	Woo! Giant E-mail! Anyway. I have been killing myself over this because I am
running a D&D game and the Exp system is just not working. For me. Others may
find it fine. I wanted something a bit better than. "Hey just estimate it." 
	By the way.. If you want it.. its a Word file. Sorry. :P 

	Oh and..umm to keep it on Topic. You can use it for DL D20. There. 
-- 
David Heth 
"Sniper rifles have been known to cause Spontaneous Brain Rejection(SBR) at
several hundred yards. "