RE: [DL] Martial Arts balance

["Leybourne, Brian" <Brian.Leybourne@airnz.co.nz>]

> Does anyone else consider the martial artists overly
> powerful, new system or old??? 

Not at all. It sounds more to me like your characters run into a fight they
couldn't handle. 9 on 5 is always going to be hard in a fist fight,
especially when the 9 have martial arts and the 5 don't. RL or in game it's
going to be a whipping.
 
> but then proceeded to use some
> lightening-looking ch'i power which did non-chippable
> damage to the tune of a Critical to the head (the GM
> admits by all rights Five Geese should have been
> dead).

Martial Artists don't have any power which does non-chippable damage. This
was your marshall making a point (i.e. Don't pick on little chinese guys
because they'll kick your arse).

> I learned from the GM
> that "martial arts" itself if a one point Edge, where
> as the Arcane Background which gives the character
> access to ch'i is the standard 3.  Here's what kicks
> me in the head: no backlash, no roll, no gear or ammo,
> no nothing: they're bare handed COMBAT MANEUVERS. 

Nope. Martial Arts is a three pointer, and you spend ANOTHER three points to
gain access to Chi powers. All bare martial arts gives you is the ability to
do lethal damage instead of brawling in hand to hand combat (and I think
adds +1d6 damage as well). Not too hot for three points really.

> Once you have the basic martial art, that's it; yours
> to use as you choose.  I have to assume that, at least
> with ch'i powers, rolls are required, but like any
> good gunslinger would ramp their skill, the martial
> artist could do the same.  After reading Goff's recent
> post about the new rule system converting martial arts
> to a single ch'i skill, this just makes it worse.

None of the matrial arts manoeuvres are overpowered, they're like the
Templar sword fighting stuff in the HOE Templars book - adds flavour without
getting overly powerful.

Chi skills do require a roll, and are very expensive to buy (double the new
power level) and the MA has to spend fate chips to gain chi points back -
this is pretty steep really.
 
> Second, martial arts are only really designed to be
> countered by a fellow martial artist.  Two characters
> with martial arts makes for an interesting and
> strategic combat, as the maneuvers can often only be
> countered by other martial arts maneuvers.  You get a
> regular old brawler in there, I don't care how good
> her or she it, and they just can't compete.

Don't maon about a system when (as you yourself admit) you know nothing
about it. Chi powers are not really any better than hexes or anything else
and they're COSTLY (both to buy and to use in chi). Brawlers have a very
good change against them, but you already admitted that your posse are all
weak brawlers and it sounds like these were good MA's.
 
> Granted, martial artists have some serious
> limitations.  They have practically no range ("Catch
> the Pearl of Death" or no), and at least as built in
> the original rules, no Dodge skill - one bullet is all
> it takes.  

There's nothing stopping a MA from buying Nimbleness: Dodge. They still use
all the same skills and abilities you do, they just add Fighting: Martial
Arts.

In short, your Marshall hosed you. He knew that you would all ignore
strategy and run into an outnumbered combat when you all suck in hand to
hand, and he used the experience to humble you a little and teach you a
lesson. As a Marshall myself, I have to say that from the tone of your
email, your posse probably deserved it. :-)

Brian "Has done far worse things to his posse" Leybourne.

.-->
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Brian Leybourne
brian.leybourne@airnz.co.nz
bleybourne@hotmail.com
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